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Part of the reason I disliked Frozen was BECAUSE it was so predictable. If there had been really engaging characters that would have made up for it, but it did not seem particularly new to me. It's just another example of what I think of as the un-fairy-tale. It's a "fairy-tale" that sets up situations as though they are going to follow some traditional disney fairy-tale tropes and then intentionally undermines them. It's not like that's necessarily bad, it's just been done a lot and consequently has it's own tropes. The more the played out how in love Hans and Anna were despite them having just met, the more you know this about undermining the 'love at first sight' cliche, and in true un-fairy-tale tradition that means making the guy she thinks she's in love with either a jerk, an idiot, or evil (or some combination of the three) to highlight how much she really didn't know him (despite him not having shown the slightest sign of being bad previously). When all the characters think that true love means romantic love, you know that since this is an un-fairy-tale it obvious doesn't and that it's really about some platonic kind of love. The only point where it seemed like it was going to do something different was when Olaf almost died to try and save Anna because he loved her, and I thought he was breaking the spell. Frankly, if the trolls weren't actively trying to kill Anna with their advice, then Olaf should have saved her. Instead the story gets twisted to fit the theme of familial love and to force the metaphor that Elsa'a heart is the one that needs thawing (when those should have naturally flowed from the story). If Anna had to show (or have?) true love for Elsa to thaw her metaphorically frozen heart in order to thaw Anna's literally frozen heart, then sending Anna after any old true love, and thus potentially away from Elsa (who we know the trolls know about) is inexcusable carelessness bordering on manslaughter.
Thank you for this as well as the original review. In which it took you three minutes to get to one of the things I found most disappointing: Elsa is the one who already has a conflict that she needs to work through, she would have made a great hero, and I wanted to see that.
Also, I found it troubling that Anna spends most of the film either engaged or being (almost) troll-wedded. She is underage. Does this child bride glorification not sound any alarms?
Your review of Frozen was spot on. I walked into Tangled in 2010 a preteen intentionally trying to hate Disney for the sake of being cool. I was expecting so much for it to be awful, and yet it blew me away. I was in love. Suddenly my passion and interest for Disney skyrocketed and I fell in love all over again. I walked into Frozen expecting a movie just as good as Tangled. I was so ready to love it and cherish it and it just took a giant shit on that. When Elsa randomly can melt all the ice because of "love", I was ready to leave the theatre. Frozen was this corporate scam of shoving a message down your throats at the expense of the characters and story. I agree with you guys, and absolutely love your videos.
It being a children's movie does not exempt it from criticism. It doesn't mean as critics or even engaged viewers that we have to give it a free pass or ignore the problems within the story because it's for kids.
Even if its targeted to kids it should be entertaining for all age groups. Disney has done movies like that in the past and it's gotten them a lot of recognition.
it has many messages in think they should have balanced time with Anna & Elsa better though. but if you want create conversation Youtube that's why Google created these new rules to prevent that that's why we should try Bing or yahoo try using Google less as possible. you probably would have look under newest for this comment
You know what would have been a really nice touch? Over the period of the 15 years, Anna and Elsa could have made a sort of communication using the door, like a certain amount of knocks means this or a pound on the door means that, or something. And when they're feeling sad (like at their parents' death), they could slide their fingers under the crack of the door and give a tiny reminder that they're there for each other (even with Elsas' gloves it would mean something). It would have given both of them much more depth and give the audience something that shows that they truly do care for each other.
these outros are fucking adorable
Booo Wendy Testaburger. Boooo. You know it sucked. Let the people know!!!
id like to hear you talk about maybe not the film itself (though i guess a film's interpretation through its fan's eyes is still its own problem) but concerning how elsa's big showstopper in let it go its viewed as a "villain's song". i dont know but… like, something is incredibly troublesome to me that as a standalone song its about no longer being afraid of people's negative fears and opinions of you but in context of the story its supposed to show how elsa is pushing herself farther away. i don't know. if anyone else could articulate this better or maybe talk more about it id love to hear it.
Simple and stupid dialogue:-"We leave right now…like, right now".
Hi guys!!!! I love this. Don't let people tell you that this is a "kids" movie. Maybe it is, but Disney has a great history of making excellent FAMILY movies, not KIDS movies. This was definitely not one of those excellent family movies, and that is maybe why your audience is misdirected. People sometimes think that animation is for "kids." Almost every other Disney animated film has been geared toward anyone, adults and children, and teach valuable life lessons to those who have not learned them yet. I have plenty of encounters with adults, sometimes even old people, who still have yet to learn these valuable lessons. But the movies are usually made in a way that is also entertaining enough for children. The expectation should never have been that Frozen would be a "kids" movie, however, maybe it was, breaking the classic mold of the Disney animated film. But I doubt that Walt Disney himself would have let this movie hit the theatres in its final form. Definitely convoluted storytelling.
it's great how much fun you guys have with this while giving incredibly insightful analysis at the same time. i love it! please continue to do these!
Just because something has "good messages" doesn't mean it's a good movie. Frozen beat their audience over the head with the "you can't marry someone you just met" idea. They sacrificed character development and relationships in favor of pointing it out over and over and over and OVER. You have to SHOW us how this is part of the story instead of SAYING it until I want to throw popcorn at the screen.
Damn I got the same super mario shirt 😀
no emotion: her parents deaths was like who gives a fuck. Did they even love them? they had no development..tarzans parents were killed in first 2 minutes but we saw that they loved him.
I think I've changed my mind on this movie a bit. I still think it's good but it's not as strong as I originally thought it to be. It is true that character development is duplicitous and ultimately lacking (though I find all of the characters likeable and all of the main characters three-dimensional), every single supporting theme is underdeveloped or hinted at and then abandoned, and the deus ex machina and resolution at the end is really kind of weak.
I've more or less lost the distinction between what I wanted this film to be and what it is. That said, and as stated previously, I still think it's damn good. There may not be much reason to really care for the plights of the characters (though I personally still do, as I find I adore the characters nonetheless), but I urge you to look more into character motivation, recurring motifs and ideas as they relate to plot and the many conflicts, and all of the themes (even though some are weak and underdeveloped, they are still good themes).
Yeah, the film is not without its flaws, but personally, I hardly think it is defined by them. And to its credit, I still think it is much more complex and mature in theme, conflict, and character motivation than most any other Disney film ever made, but that doesn't detract from it, it makes it better and more realistic in how we relate to the world and the characters. I really think there's a lot more going on in it than you guys gives it credit for.
Another extremely well done video about Frozen is this one /watch?v=p7Et4o5LoJA and since it is mostly discussing the good points of the movie, I really think this movie completes your point of view for an overall objective analysis of the movie. One comment that I saw for the video and was completely true I have to put it here : "We saw too few of Elsa. And her powers. She should have had a montage w[h]ere she tries to control her powers while being lock[ed] in her room instead of her just laying around. " You should really watch the video, especially starting at 9:30 the points are pure gold imo.
As for the musical reprise that could have made frozen even better, there is ths one too http://inkclaws.tumblr.com/post/70975585121/carriepotter-this-is-what-i-imagined-elsa-to-beMy opinion on the movie : personally, I loved Frozen and I understand the flows, but the heart of the story, as well as the songs, are pure gold. If you see the movie as an end in itself, you can analyze it and see its flows. If you take it as a story for your imagination and don't go too deep into analyzing the movie, you can still get the spirit of it without the flows because it is made to be understandable. As for me, animation movies are there to expand your imagination (that's something I love to do), and they do it well because they use pictures and music as data to feed your imagination.Animation movies being awkardly refered to as "movies for kids" is another point I wwant to discuss. I think it would be closer to truth to say that these movies choose to insist on the story they are telling rather than changing the story in order to easily build a structured movie (structured movie being seen as "good movie" because the actions of the characters are "realistic"). Animation movies don't let go the spirit of the story in order to "structure better" a movie.The format of the movie is one criticize it recieved, as an example let's talk about the "10min for 15 years" and "all the action of the film under 48h", taken from another criticism video. Basically the ~15 years were here to show the determination and mental-strength of Elsa, who is, in my eyes, a heroine throughout the whole movie because she basically sacrificies her life by staying alone in order to avoid hurting even the least important person of her kingdom, she even gives up the throne and decides to hide her true love for her sister because she knows she couldn't let Anna go again if Anna knew the love was reverse, and Elsa would end up hurting her some day. The most touching part of it is that she is not given much screen-time, which makes her a silent heroine that doesn't recieve the credit she deserves for her sacrifice.Now basically, the action HAD to be within 48h, because just as you said in the previous video, she can't eat ice. The only other way to make the action last longer, was Elsa staying in her castle. Bam, this is a completely new story, this is not Frozen.This format problem is, in my opinion, a perfect example of the difficulties Disney faced, but they never let go the spirit of the story in order to get some more realism, and that is what I loved. I love animation movies because they start on fresh new thing. Here, let's take an hypothesis : "A princess has magical powers but can't control them" and let's try to build something realistic from that, what could happen ? She could turn evil or be insanely mentally-strong. (I was waiting for her determination to collapse and for her to turn evil, but that never happened and this really made me love this movie for that, this really shows how deep she loves every person in her kingdom, which is for me the true proof of her deserving the throne). How is it possible to be that mentally strong and how could she move from that unstable state (not controlling her powers) to a stable one, being either she never controls her powers and is alone, or find a way to control them, and what would it take to reach that stable state ? These are the questions I was wondering about in this movie, and taking the images and musics of it as an extension to my imagination really made me feel I was dreaming. I use the movie as guidelines for my imagination and see if it can drive me to where Disney wants, and every animation movie just makes my imagination grow in a new way, that's what is awesome about them.tl;dr : Animation movies are here mainly to tell a story, and sometimes they have to let flows in their structure in order to keep the heart and spirit of the story. Also these movies start on an unrealistic hypothesis, and try to build something realistic from it. This is exactly how you should proceed when you try to expand your thinking range. This is why I love animation movies, they expand my imagination like nothing else can.
I don't think it's really just a 'kids' movie I saw it with my 15 year old bro. and my friends we all came out of it enjoying it as a film in general and seeing pretty deep concepts in there that kids wouldn't pick up.. Disney movies for the most part aren't just 'kids' movies or for little girls or any of that, we just have to go in and analyze what we see a little more. For instance, did you know it had subtexts about homosexuality?
Just an idea, you should do a review on. Video games as well. Should do one on the Final Fantasy 13 trilogy. There are cutscenes mayhems so they are like movies. Just a thought. I'd like to see you guys make a critical analysis on how the story is told and such as well as an analysis on the characters themselves. (Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII-2, and Final Fantasy XIII: Lightning Returns.) Thank you~!
Hey you guys,In both of these Frozen videos, you've perfectly brought to light the aspects of Frozen that made it bad movie. I've never seen a more satisfying critical analysis. Despite what others may say, I think you should continue to trust your instincts in regard to storytelling. Many fans of the movie are trying to sell the movie based on the message that it tried to send and what this type of movie means to the industry going forward. In other words, they really only like the idea of it. It doesn't seem as though they've judged the movie based on how effectively it presented its message or conveyed the story. Once again, your analysis was spot on: the plot, theme, songs (too Broadway!), storytelling, character development, etc. You guys nailed it.
They do have some points but lots of it doesn't make sense to me. Have a reaction on this link, pointing out some flaws and a little analysis of Frozen. Check it out if you feel like it 🙂
Man I hate when people say Disney movies are kid's movies ahahaha. Disney movies are FAMILY movies. Sure, in most of the movies the main audience are the kids, but they always have something meant to the grown ups too. Also, would you tell me that, for example, the Hunchback of Notre Dame and Pocahontas are mostly for kids?
I guess my most useful comment at this point (because you've already done a response after the initial review) is on the whole "act of true love" statement being vague. We know that the act that saved Anna was laying down her own life for her sister. What we may have not realized was that the act had to be DONE BY ANNA. Otherwise Kristoff's long ride to deliver Anna to Hans when he himself loved her could have qualified (not just wanting her to stay alive, but also wanting her to be happy, even if he is miserable). Or, if we want to avoid the whole love interest saving the day bit, it could've been Olaf's refusal to leave the fire and then how he cared for her after Hans left her for dead.
That's all I'll say for now. Changing topics: great analysis you guys! I can't wait to see what you do next!
I think art and entertainment while different are intrinsically linked. Art is communication and communication requires an audience to be comfortable enough to listen, if I angrily whisper everything no one is going to give a damn what I'm saying, but if I present myself in a way that attracts attention but not animosity then people listen and learn. Entertainment is a tool that artists have use. Likewise if I go around talking about nothing with all the skill of the greatest of orators my audience is going to be bored and frustrated by me because I'm insulting them in thinking that all they care about is the way I sound. Even wrestling has ideas, hell even regular sports, weather on purpose or by accident has narratives and ideas. Obviously a creator can value one over the other but they must still pay attention to both.
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