Famed medical examiner makes explosive claim regarding Epstein’s death

Famed medical examiner makes explosive claim regarding Epstein’s death


STEVE: IT HAS BEEN NEARLY THREE MONTHS SINCE AMERICAN FINANCIER AND ALLEGED SEX TRAFFICKER JEFFREY EPSTEIN. HIS DEATH RULED A SUICIDE HERE IN NEW YORK BACK IN AUGUST. AINSLEY: OUR NEXT GUEST WAS TAPPED BY EPSTEIN’S TEAM TO OBSERVE THE AUTOPSY AND IS HERE TO REVEAL THE FINDINGS FROM HIS INVESTIGATION. BRIAN: JOINING US RIGHT NOW FORMER NEW YORK CITY MEDICAL EXAMINER DR. MICHAEL BADEN. IS HE A FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST. FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR AND JOINS US RIGHT NOW FOR EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW. DR. BADEN, THANKS FOR BEING HERE.>>GOOD MORNING. BRIAN: WHEN DID YOU REALIZE THAT THE EPSTEIN FAMILY NEEDED HELP?>>WELL, I WAS ASKED BY THE BROTHER, NEXT OF KIN, TO BE AT THE AUTOPSY AND AT THE AUTOPSY ON DAY ONE, THERE WERE FINDINGS THAT WERE USUAL FOR SUICIDAL HANGING AND MORE CONSISTENT WITH LIGATURE HOMICIDAL STRANGULATION WHICH INCLUDED. STEVE: IT WAS SUGGESTED AT THE TIME THAT HE COMMITTED SUICIDE BY DOING, WHAT?>>BY HANGING AT THE TIME HE WAS FOUND ALLEGEDLY HANGING BY A WHOM MADE LIGATURE OF SHEETS. AINSLEY: ARE YOU SAYING YOU DON’T THINK IT WAS SUICIDE?>>I THINK THAT THE EVIDENCE POINTS TOWARDS HOMICIDE RATHER THAN SUICIDE. AINSLEY: WHY?>>BECAUSE THERE ARE MULTIPLE THREE FRACTURES IN THE HYOID BONE, THE THYROID CARTILAGE THAT ARE VERY UNUSUAL FOR SUICIDE AND MORE INDICATIVE OF STRANGULATION, HOMICIDAL STRANGULATION. STEVE: LET’S TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT THE MEDICAL EXAMINER STATED AFTER CAREFUL REVIEW OF ALL THE INVESTIGATIVE INFORMATION, INCLUDING COMPLETE AUTOPSY FINDINGS, THE DETERMINATION ON THE DEATH OF EPSTEIN IS BELOW. CAUSE, HANGING. MANNER, SUICIDE. YOU SAY THAT HIS FATAL INJURIES ARE CONSISTENT WITH HOMICIDE?>>MORE CONSISTENT WITH HOMICIDE AND, IN FACT, AT THE TIME OF THE AUTOPSY, THE DOCTOR DOING THE AUTOPSY WASN’T — DIDN’T THINK IT WAS ENOUGH INFORMATION TO SAY SUICIDE SO SHE PUT IT PENDING FURTHER STUDY AND THEN FOR SOME — AND THE FAMILY WANTS TO KNOW WHY WAS IT CHANGED FROM PENDING FURTHER STUDIES TO HOMICIDE AFTERWARDS. AINSLEY: IF YOU ARE THERE WATCHING THEM PERFORM THIS AUTOPSY, YOU NOTICE THESE THREE BROKEN BONES AND YOU BELIEVE IT WOULD BE HOMICIDE. THAT WOULD MEAN ANOTHER PERSON WOULD HAVE GONE INTO HIS CELL, STRANGLED HIM. DID HE HAVE ANY SIGNS OF TRYING TO FIGHT BACK?>>WELL, THEY TOOK FINGER NAIL CLIPPING TO SEE IF THERE IS ANYBODY ELSE’S D.N.A. ON IT. AND THAT HASN’T BEEN RELEASED. NEITHER HAS THE INFORMATION ABOUT WHOSE D.N.A. IS ON THE LIGATURE. LIGATURE MADE OUT OF TORN STRIPS OF ORANGE SHEETS. AND WHOEVER MADE IT, HAD TO HAVE A LOT OF D.N.A. ON IT. AND THE BROTHER HAS BEEN ASKING THAT FROM DAY ONE. BRIAN: SO WAIT A SECOND. YOU ARE SAY WHOEVER MADE IT HAS TO HAVE A LOT OF D.N.A. ON IT AND THERE WAS?>>NONE AT ALL WE DON’T KNOW WHO EXAMINED IT. BRIAN: YOU SAY WHEN YOU LEFT THE EXAMINATION ROOM THEY WEREN’T SURE WHAT HAPPENED.>>THAT’S RIGHT. BRIAN: YOU KNOW THIS PROCEDURE. WHAT HAPPENED IN THE INTERIM TO GET THIS SUCH A BLUNT CONCLUSION?>>A WEEK LATER, IT WAS CHANGED TO HOMICIDE. THE BROTHER WANTS TO KNOW WHAT DID THEY GET NEW IN THAT WEEK TO MAKE IT HOMICIDE. BRIAN: WHAT’S YOUR ANSWER TO THAT?>>WE DON’T KNOW. IT’S 80 DAYS NOW. AND THE BROTHER FEELS HE IS GETTING THE RUN AROUND. AND TO ADD TO IT, THERE WAS A TOTAL BREAKDOWN IN SECURITY. THE VIDEO CAMERAS DIDN’T WORK. THE GUARDS WENT TO SLEEP. THE. STEVE: WHAT ABOUT THAT GUY WHO WAS IN THE CELL WITH HIM EARLIER WHERE IT WAS SUGGESTED THAT THAT GUY TRIED TO KILL HIM?>>HE HAD A NEW ROOMMATE NOW BECAUSE SUICIDE WATCH. DIFFERENT ROOMMATE. THAT ROOMMATE WAS PULLED AWAY A DAY OR TWO BEFORE SO THAT THERE WAS NO ROOMMATE WITH HIM. NO SUICIDE WATCH. NO SECURITY GUARDS, NO VIDEOTAPES THAT WERE WORKING. DID THE FBI ABLE TO GET THE INFORMATION FROM THE VIDEO. AINSLEY: I KNOW YOU WERE HIRED BACK IN THE 70’S TO DO THIS AS YOUR JOB. YOU REALLY INVESTIGATED DEATHS IN PRISON AFTER THE RITE AND ALL RIOT AND ALL THESE PRISONERS DIED. WHAT ARE THE CHANCES NOT BEING CHECKED ON 3:30 TO 6:30 FINDING HIS BODY AND TWO PRISON GUARDS FALLING ASLEEP.>>EXTREMELY UNLIKELY. NEVER SEEN N 50 YEARS ALL DEATHS THAT OCCUR IN PRISONS IN NEW YORK STATE. NEVER HAD TWO GUARDS FALL ASLEEP AT THE SAME TIME ALL THE VIDEO DOESN’T WORK. THE ISSUE WOULD BE DID SOMEBODY COME IN AND CAUSE HIS DEATH? STEVE: WHAT ABOUT THE SUGGESTION YOU MAY BE BIASED BECAUSE YOU WERE HIRED BY THE FAMILY?>>THAT’S ALWAYS A SITUATION EXCEPT THAT GOVERNOR ROCKEFELLER AFTER ATTICUS SET UP A SPECIAL BOARD TO LOOK INTO ALL DEATHS IN NEW YORK PRISONS BECAUSE CONCERN POLICE MEDICAL EXAMINERS AND GUARDS WERE BIASED WHEN THE INMATES COMPLAINED THAT DEATHS WERE BEING COVERED UP AND WE HAVE A SEPARATE BOARD THAT LOOKS INTO ALL THESE DEATHS. BRIAN: DR. BADEN WHAT I DON’T UNDERSTAND IS IF EVERYBODY WANTS THE SAME THING, THE TRUTH, THE BROTHER SHOULDN’T BE FIGHTING ANYTHING. THEY SHOULD BE INTERVIEWING YOU AND SAYING TELL ME ABOUT WHAT YOU HAVE. HAVE PEOPLE INVESTIGATING THIS CASE PRIOR TO THEM RULING IT A SUICIDE, CONTACTED YOU.>>NOT AT ALL. NONE. BRIAN: DO YOU FIND THAT STRANGE?>>YES. ASK THE ATTORNEY GENERAL IS INVESTIGATING THE CAUSE OF DEATH AS THEY ARE DOING THE SECURITY ON THIS ISSUE. SOMEBODY SHOULD HAVE BEEN INVESTIGATING EVERYBODY WHO HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE AUTOPSY. BRIAN: SURE. AINSLEY: IF THERE WAS A PRISONER WHO WENT IN AND STRANGLED HIM THE D.N.A. IS ON THAT.>>LIGATURE. AINS THE BED SHEETS. WOULDN’T IT BE EASY TO TRACK DOWN WHO THAT PERSON WAS.>>ABSOLUTELY. ABSOLUTELY. THAT’S THE FIRST THING. THE MEDICAL EXAMINER AT THE TIME OF THE FIRST AUTOPSY DID SWABS ALL THE CLOTHING FOR D.N.A., BUT WHO HAD THE LIGATURE. AINSLEY: WHO HAS THAT INFORMATION? WHY ISN’T THAT BEING RELEASED?>>THAT’S WHAT THE BROTHER WANTS TO KNOW. THAT’S WHY THEY ASKED ME TO COME HERE. STEVE: YOU ARE CALLING ON THE STATE TO FIGURE OUT WHOSE D.N.A. IS ON THAT?>>NOT THE STATE, UNFORTUNATELY. THIS IS A FEDERAL PRISON. SO THE STATE HAS NOTHING. THE FBI USUALLY INVESTIGATES — WOULD BE INVESTIGATING IT. AND THE BROTHER WANTS TO KNOW ONE, DID THE FBI GET AHOLD OF THAT LIGATURE AND, TWO, IT ONLY TAKE AS COUPLE DAYS TO DO THE D.N.A. WHAT’S THE RESULTS? BRIAN: DR. BADEN, I KNOW YOU ARE JUST SOMEBODY WHO LOOKS AT A SITUATION CUT AND DRY. I’M LOOKING AT D.N.A. LOOKING AT HARD FACTS. HOW IMPORTANT, IN YOUR INVESTIGATION CONCLUSION IS HIS MIND SET PRIOR TO SUICIDE? AND THE FACT THAT HE HAD PLANNED AFTERWARDS AND THAT HE SPENT SO MUCH TIME WITH HIS LAWYERS THE DAY BEFORE.>>YES. YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. THE GREAT MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WHO COMMIT SUICIDE GIVE WARNING SIGNS AHEAD. NOW, ONE OF THE WARNING SIGNS COULD HAVE BEEN THE INCIDENT JULY 23RD WHEN HE SAID. THE ROOMMATE ASSAULTED HIM AND THE GUARDS SAID IT WAS SUICIDE ATTEMPT. AND THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN WATCHING HIM. THEY DIDN’T WATCH HIM, ACCORDING TO THE GUARDS, ACCORDING TO HIS LAWYERS AT THAT TIME. HE WAS IN GOOD MOOD. HE WAS STILL WAITING FOR A DECISION WHETHER HE CAN GET OUT ON BAIL. THAT HADN’T COME YET. STEVE: HE HAD SO MANY VICTIMS. I THINK IT THE VICTIMS REALLY DESERVE TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED.>>YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. A LOT OF THINGS HAPPENED. ALSO THE BROTHER IS CONCERNED THAT IF HE WAS MURDERED THEN OTHER PEOPLE WHO HAVE INFORMATION MIGHT BE AT RISK, IN JEOPARDY. BRIAN: LOOK, THE HEART DOESN’T GO OUT WITH THIS GUY. THIS GUY SEEMS LIKE JUST A TERRIBLE PERSON, USED HIS POWER AND MANIPULATION, ABILITY FOR EVIL MEANS. I GET IT?>>RIGHT. BRIAN: BUT THERE ARE SO MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE IMPLICATED IN HIS WEB OF UGLINESS, YOU WONDER, YOU WONDER IF THIS PLAYS A ROLE. THE POWERFUL PEOPLE THAT HIS ANTICS AFFECTED AND WOULD HAVE BEEN AFFECTED HAD HE LIVED.>>YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. THAT’S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THE BROTHER THINKS AS WELL. IF THEY THINK HE HAS INFORMATION THAT HIS LIFE COULD BE IN JEOPARDY. AINSLEY: WHAT DOES THE BROTHER TELL YOU HE THINKS HAPPENED?>>HE THINKS HE WANTS TO FIND THE ANSWER TO. HE THINKS THAT HIS BROTHER WASN’T TYPE TO COMMIT SUICIDE BUT HE HASN’T BEEN ABLE TO GET INFORMATION. BRIAN: HOW HARD IS IT TO COMMIT SUICIDE IN PRISON.>>VERY EASY. BUT, FIRST, IN THIS SITUATION IF I SITUATION HF I SITUATION HE I SITUATION HE TOOK THE SHEETS TAKEN A HALF HOUR TO MAKE THE LIGATURE. ONCE YOU ARE HANGING IT’S ABOUT FIVE MINUTES OR SO YOU CAN HAVE — BE NEAR DEAD. STEVE: DR. BADEN, YOU KNOW, IF THE SUPPOSITION IS THAT IT WAS A HOMICIDE. THAT WOULD MEAN COPS WERE IN ON IT, YOU KNOW, WHO OPENED THE DOOR? WHO MOVED THE CAMERAS, ALL OF IT. AINSLEY: WAS IT SOMEONE ONS OUTSIDE OR INSIDE JOB?>>THAT’S RIGHT. STEVE: THAT’S A TERRIBLE ALLEGATION.>>WELL, WHY WERE TWO GUARDS ASLEEP IN 50 YEARS OF LOOKING AT DEATHS IN NEW YORK STATE, OCCASIONALLY A GUARD FALLS ASLEEP.>>NEVER TWO GUARDS AT THE SAME TIME. THE CELL, THE CAMERA IN THE CELL WATCHING DIDN’T WORK. THE CAMERA IN THE HALLWAY TO SEE IF ANYBODY CAME IN AND OUT OF HIS CELL DIDN’T WORK. THIS IS BIZARRE. HIS ROOMMATE WAS TAKEN AWAY SO HE WAS ALL BY HIMSELF. SUICIDE WATCH WAS TAKEN AWAY. YEAH, THE ISSUE YOU BRING UP HAS TO BE INVESTIGATE YOU HAD. DOESN’T MEAN THIS IS HOMICIDE BUT CERTAINLY IT DESERVES INVESTIGATION AND THE BROTHER IS CONCERNED THERE IS NO INVESTIGATION. AINSLEY: HAVE YOU EVER SEEN ANYONE THAT COMMITTED SUICIDE AND WAS HANGING THEMSELVES WITH THOSE THREE BROKEN BONES?>>NO. HANGING DOES NOT CAUSE THESE BROKEN BONES AND HOMICIDE DOES. USUALLY TWO BONES, EVEN THREE IS A HUGE AMOUNT OF PRESSURE WAS APPLIED. BRIAN: HOW DIFFERENT IS THIS FOR ANYONE LET ALONE HIGH PROFILE PRISON.>>800 OTHER PEOPLE IN THE CORRECTION FACILITY AND MOST OF THEM WOULD HAVE LIKENED TO HAVE GOTTEN THEIR HANDS ON HIM ONE BECAUSE OF SEXUAL THINGS, TWO TO MAKE A NAME FOR THEMSELVES. THREE, BECAUSE SOMEBODY PUT THEM UP TO IT. YOU ARE RIGHT THOUGH, A NUMBER OF PEOPLE HAD TO BE INVOLVED IF THIS IS A HOMICIDE. STEVE: DR. BADEN, THANK YOU VERY MUCH. HE JUST SAID THAT THE FATAL INJURIES ARE CONSISTENT WITH HOMICIDE. AND YOU HAVE ALSO CALLED ON THE FEDS TO FIGURE OUT WHOSE D.N.A. IS ON THAT THING THAT HE HUNG HIMSELF WITH IF HE HUNG HIMSELF. DR. BADEN THANK YOU VERY

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